In August, I completed my Master of Business Administration (MBA) degree with the University of Phoenix Online. I’m putting together a series about the entire experience.
When I started working for my current employer in 2002, I decided to take advantage of the practically free education they were offering, 90% reimbursement for any work-related classes passed. (Later on, the conditions for 90% reimbursement changed to only courses passed with a “C” average or above.) The MBA seemed to be a good fit for me, and the curriculum would be general enough for me to take it with me wherever I end up going — and whatever I end up doing — in the long run. But what about the “online” component?
As an undergraduate at the University of Delaware in 1998, I had my first experience with online learning. I took a 600-level course, “Multimedia Literacy,” with the professor who developed the distance learning system for the University. This system was one of the first envinronments to incorporate learning over the internet. When considering schools for my graduate degree, I was — and still am — convinced the internet will be a great tool for distance education. The technology wasn’t perfect yet, as I would find out later, but I had heard good things from reliable sources about the University of Phoenix’s online program.
Back to my current company in 2003, I had many different commitments competing for my attention, and I liked the idea of not having to travel to a classroom. It was never a question that I would be comfortable with an online learning environment. After all, I had been involved with the development of websites since 1994 and with the general internet since the latter part of the 1980s.
I didn’t see a need to go to a high-powered, top ten business school. I don’t love business. In fact, most of the time, I don’t even like business. I know people who make “business” their life, and I do not want to be one of them. I did not want to surround myself with people who live and breathe “business.” The University of Phoenix Online, who in 2003 wasn’t the spammer and pop-up ad king it became, was a good fit.
I did have a concern. The University of Phoenix is a for profit, public business, meaning they might put the needs of their shareholders ahead of the needs of their students. In reality, every school has this attitude to varying extents. They may not have shareholders per se, but universities must keep happy those who give money to fund laboratories, new construction, and competitive programs. All colleges must devise ways to generate as much money as possible, from alumni, benefactors, and students. No institute of higher education can function without finding ways to raise money.
In August 2003, I weighed my options and made the decision to attend the University of Phoenix Online, clearly the leader in online learning at the time. I began the admissions process, which I will write about in a following post.
This is Part 1 of a series about my experiences with the University of Phoenix Online. Here is what has been published so far.
* Part 1: The Decision
* Part 2: Admissions
* Part 3: Course Logistics
* Part 4: Curriculum
* Part 5: The Team Experience
* Part 6: Administration
* Part 7: Finishing Up
About the Author
{ 6 trackbacks }
{ 24 comments… read them below or add one }
I’m looking forward to hearing about your experience there. In recent years I kind of think of it as one of those “mail-in degree” places the way the advertising sounds, but hopefully you can shed some light on this.
The University of Phoenix is definitely not a “degree mill” as some people seem to think. I plan on addressing that in a future post.
glad you are doing this. i have been interested in hearing more details on your experience and thoughts.
thanks.
I am eagerly awaiting the next posts on this. I hadn’t taken online degrees that seriously but I have had more than one person ask me if I knew much about them in the last few months. It will be interesting to hear how your experiences with it compares to traditional universities.
I am looking forward to reading your take on the UoP experience. I completed my undergraduate degree online. I am considering a bricks and mortar institution for my next journey but only because I am considering a dual MBA/JD program. Though if I could find a reputable online Law School program I would consider it.
I looked at a friends MBA course material from U of P and I was rather impressed. She went to actual classes one night a week too, so it might be a little different. It also appeared that many of the professors work in the field, rather than primarily academia lifers. They do need to stop the pop up advertising though.
Great to hear that you finished up your degree. I have been wondering about online schools for a while now. I look forward to the rest of your posts about it.
Thanks for the comments; I’m glad I have a few readers interested in reading more. I’ve completed Part 2, and it will be posted on Monday. Hopefully I’ve have more written over the weekend!
U of P has a stadium now…
http://www.azfamily.com/
I share your enthusiasm about an online MBA degree from UoPhx. I have 4 classes left in my program there and have been doing most of it online.
I find it to be tremendously applicable to my worklife and satisfies my need for balance with home.
As with anything in life, the more you put into it – the more you get out. I took the program to learn and gain knowledge for ME not because it would get me promoted or earn me more money ( unlikely in either case). I am totally satisfied so far. Great for my needs.
what I would like to know is do you know of anyone in the phoenix area that teaches classes on vintage costume jewelry? thank you toni gelazin
First, let me say that I am huge fan of education in any form. Second, I should probably mention that I recently obtained my MBA from a top 25 school. Some might say that this would make me biased, however, I would argue that this is evidence of me ‘putting my money where my mouth is’ as I certainly could have chosen the online degree route if I had chosen.
While an online degree can certainly provide you the same nuts and bolts education that traditional schools provide, you are also missing out on a lot of other qualities that go along with a formal education. You are not immersed in the curriculum. Your opportunities to learn from fellow students (a huge factor is an MBA education) is very limited. I greatly question learning from an instructor who has a suspect day job (although you get some of these at any university) versus an instructor who is at the top of his field/Noble prize winner, etc.
Learning how to employ an options strategy or about WalMart’s logistics or whatever the case may be is just one part of business school. Is sitting in the front row, behind home plate at a baseball game the same as watching it on a 13″ TV? Is going out on a blind date the same as chatting with a stranger on AOL IM?
As I said, I applaud your taking the steps to educate yourself. The major draw of an MBA education for many is for a bump in salary and access to better jobs. I seriously doubt any employer would grant these for an online degree. A online degree seems more akin to adult education classes on Tuesday nights at the local community college. Sure, that’s great that you’re learning something, but to then take the step and pretend that its the same as a graduate degree, I find that a little bit naive.
That being said, you seemed to indicate that you didn’t want it to become a ‘business person.’ it seemed to be more for your own benefit rather than for a resume builder/career advancement/networking, etc. If that’s the case, then I think an online degree was perfect in your situation. Let’s just not pretend that it’s something it isn’t.
Mike-
I am a student at U of P, and currently need 3 classes to graduate. I have earned a 3.78 GPA thus far. The points you made are invalid, and not true.
At U of P, I spend 20-25 hours per week on class work. This is more work then ALL other MBA programs in our nation according to U.S. news and world reports survey in 2008. During those 20-25 hours per week online I spend a great deal of time posting on the class forum. I usually post about 4-6 posts per day, each of which are about as long as this post, only I am required to include an APA formatted reference to a text book or other academically acceptable source within the body of the text. In addition, my last professor for example, commented on all of my posts, giving me personal indebt lectures on the material at hand.
You mentioned that learning from other students is very limited, how would you know this? By allowing students to calmly put their thoughts in order and express them succinctly on a forum, we distill out many of the conversational dribble that has to take place in face to face communication, and all of our ‘words’ are saved on the forum for us to review and reread at our pleasure. We are required to ‘participate’ 4 out of the 7 days of the week, and this participation includes posting substantial posts on each others work/assignments. The average age of U of P MBA students is 36, and the age/maturity shows up in our class forums, with articulate and insightful posts.
Also, we have 2 team assignments per class.
The material as you pointed out is similar from school to school. What I found to be the negative aspect of U of P you eluded to is the respect and or almuni network. Hopefully the repuation of U of P will change as more alumni demonstrate thier ability and level of education.
I am financing my MBA with my own money, and its a huge investment on my part. So far I am extremely satisfied with my education. I have relatives and friends that currently attending and/or graduated from traditional MBA schools. Comparing course work and requirements my classes are proving to be more comprehensive, challenging, and educational. Most of my professors have 30+ years experience in the field they are teaching.
-Shazam
In his comments above, “Mike” summed it up beautifully. You ask any HR director what U of P does to a resume and he will tell you “nothing.” In fact, for a position requiring a higher degree, U of P will get the resume put in the circular file. Unfortunately, U of P is not, and most likely will not, equate to a true graduate degree. I would not have even considered U of P when I earned my MBA.
I have to say that I have been at UOP for 2 1/2 years getting ready to graduate with my BA in Human Services/ Management and it has been the best experience ever. I have attended on ground in class setting then transfered to online and I love it. I will continue on to get my Masters in Criminal Law. There is commencement that everyone can attend in an Arena to walk with cap and gown and that to is a great experience. So this is not just an online paper in the mail hoax, it is a true accredited degree system that is proven to work. Many of the teachers have experience in the field you are in and have a degree to support their professional teaching. I’d rather have someone teach me from experience and history with that particular field than someone that has just received a teaching degree.
Mike:-
I disagree that there are less chances to learn from your classmates in an online format. I actually think that there are greater opportunities to learn from them. In a regular classroom, time is limited to a couple of hours a week and invariably, there are a couple of people who always speak up, while the quieter ones at the back stay quiet. In an online format, the classroom is open 24/7, everyone has to speak, and often it is the quieter ones who have the most to contribute, and they are given the space to make their contributions too. Not only that, but the ‘facelessness’ of the online format also means that people who are naturally reticent feel more comfortable opening up.
I have experienced both mediums in education and I think that, in general, there was more discussion and more participation from the online medium.
Mike sounds a little bitter that he spent all that money at a “top 25 school” and the online program is challenging his manhood.
Mike,
If you believe that certain (not all) online programs can’t give you a quality education, you are living in the past, or living in a fantasy land. I haven’t gone to UoP, but I’ve done some research. They are accredited. They use collaboration amongst the students to maximize learning. Employers DO accept it as a valid masters degree. There are people that get their masters degree from UoP by going to the class room for all their classes. How is any employer going to distinguish these people from the folks that took all their classes online? Are they going to throw out all job applicants from UoP? I don’t think so. 75% of business colleges are unaccredited. I can see an argument against these unaccredited colleges and universities. But, you have to be doing something right to remain amongst the 25% of accredited institutions.
Don’t be bitter Mike. Welcome to the 21st century. We’re glad to have you, even if you did go to a brick-and-mortar college/university :-)
STAY AWAY FROM UOP ONLINE!!!! Got to Ripoffreport.com and you will soon see what I mean. My wife and I attended this school hoping to better ourselves through an education system that met our schedual as we do have kids that we have to work around. A pell grant was awarded to us and it paid for the first two classes. We had to take a two week break to move and were suppose to be reinstated in our classes after that period, but it never happened. We got the run around on the phone with the counselors as to why, and in the end we told them we were finished. Also the education level you’ll get there is a joke. I wrote my first paper for my writing class and I did it in one night. It was loaded with errors and I was positive I would get a lousy grade. The teacher took about three weeks to get me the grade and it was an A. It had spelling errors out the yang and my sources were not cited the correct way. (and if my spelling is off in this post you can chalk it up to my poor college education :) In other words, they give you the grade that you don’t deserve. How is this learning anything? Remember I said our pell grant took care of the first two classes? UOP recently told us that it didn’t and now we owe citibank for our loan (a loan we never signed for in the first place. We know that the pell took care of the first two classes because we recieved a letter stating so from the school. Whats wrong with this picture? In the end we now owe thousands of dollars for an education we didn’t recieve and the buck has been passed so many times its unbelievable. Like I said, you can read more stories like this one at ripoffreport.com.
Hi everyone,
Just wanted to give my feedback on my experience at U of P for the MBA program. I work at Yahoo! and started taking my mba online last year. I can fully appreciate the comments made earlier about the importance of face to face education. However, to claim that U of P is not accredited or looked at favorably by companies is simply not true at all. The education experience is also very good… assuming you put the personal effort required into it.
I was encouraged to attend U of P online by our HR department… so that eliminates the other guys *assumption* that HR departments place U of P down the list. I chose U of P because of scheduling and because I wanted to learn from students and professors actually WORKING IN THE FIELD and APPLYING their learning. Not from professors with awards in theory with no actual real world experience behind them.
I am a fan of both forms of education… and had the choice to attend either or… and chose U of P… and its been awesome.
30% of the your grade is based on group interaction…. and that is pretty significant. Through email, chat, phone conferencing and other means you are required to stay in touch and participate regularly.
As for the A grade for a crappy paper…. that student sounded pretty obviously bitter that his financial situation and lack of scheduling organization screwed him up… like its the university’s fault that your schedule changed. Always funny how the people who quit or have an admin problem come up with the horror stories of grades and quality. All i can say is that in my experience… being a A student my whole life…. the assignments have not been that easy…. and they force you to APPLY the theory to ACTUAL business scenarios that are current…. and my employer specifically… loves that…. as goes Google, Apple and other major tech firms who are with the 21st century. You will see when you talk to your class mates. If you are on the fence…. try it out.
Only down side… is that without the face to face interaction with the prof you do lose out on points of emphasis… and end up relying a lot on your own reading, interpretation, and retention skills. If you do not work well as an individual… cannot self motivate to actually learn and retain information… or prefer being taught in a class environment… this is certainly not for you… and you will be very dissatisfied. If you are a self motivated learner and like to APPLY what you learn while collaborating with people internationally…. this is definitely for you.
Cheers
Darryl
Hi,
I attended the University of Phoenix for about two years and then transfered to Oregon State University. I had no problem transfering my credits and I got a decent education for the first two years. The only problems that I had with U of P is that they are very exspensive and the advisors are all about money. They are not very much help at all and they lie a lot. I ended up transfering from U of P two classes before I received my AA degree only because I had to in order to get into the other university. The advisors gave me a very hard time by telling me I couldn’t leave early, then ended up charging me $500.00 out of pocket, even when I had a loan to cover it. They told me that I had to finish the last two classes in order to receive any more funds from my lender. I am still not sure why I had to pay it, but they kept telling me that they were going to turn it into collections. Aside ffrom all of that it was an ok experience.
I attended the University of Phoenix as a result of its flexibility. My job at the time was not a traditional 9-5 position. I did work for a major Fortune 500 Corporation which provided me with complete tuition assistance. I am intelligent and I had many school options available yet the University of Phoenix was the best fit for me. The instructors come from extremely diverse backgrounds. I attended classes at an actual campus once a week in addition to online classes. My public speaking ability increased and my knowledge continues to grow. University of Phoenix is reputable and as an M.B.A graduate I have acquired the respect I deserve. My instructors came from top performing schools and corporations. The instructors were very qualified. I am not on here to compare and contrast rather the traditional method is better than the more modern techniques. My point is that the world continues to evolve and University of Phoenix provides excellent technology which is useful in helping many students successfully meet their educational goals. Through obtaining my M.B.A from the University of Phoenix I am continuing to prove that I am an asset as en employee in addition to competitive enough to keep up with the competition.
Sincerely
Marie Thomas
mt
I must say, reading the comments brought me to finally just add my two cents; I do respect everyone’s opinions since we are all entitled to them. I can only speak of my experience. First of all I am a U of P graduate and will be the first to admit I had mixed feelings about U of P until I went there and then everything became clear to me. I do see both points of views so let me start off by saying I did attend a traditional college but wasn’t content from the 30-40 students in an auditorium and teachers not knowing me. There are some benefits to those professors but as for me, I can say I do appreciate the smaller classrooms and one-on-one experience I received from the professors at U of P, in addition I really enjoy the interaction. I especially liked the fact that I have an teacher who is teaching on experience not just text book material and students like a guy I had that worked at Microsoft who during a marketing class was giving input as to what Microsoft was doing at that time in terms of marketing. It was all real time. I was nice to know I could know what was happening right then and there and not read about it later. I didn’t do the online course although I did have the experience of taking about two online courses during my studies and they worked very well. In fact one of the professors at one of the campuses I attended was a Stanford graduate and he would say often that U of P was the next new thing, in fact U of P paved the way through its online success, for other major universities that now offer some online courses. I’ve worked at fortune 500 companies and in my last position I found out that my branch manager had a bachelors in project management and accounting from U of P and the district manager had received her MBA from U of P so that alone gave me confidence that U of P is noticed by some higher ups (this was at Citigroup). My older sister graduated from U of P and she went to work for Warner Brothers my younger sister also is a U of P grad and she went to work within Macy’s marketing department which she then with her degree leveraged a job at Tommy Bahama. My point being is I really haven’t heard of anyone who has graduated (and I mean completed the program not just taken a course or two) that hasn’t benefited from their degree and education. I believe your always going to have someone that’s not content but your education is what you make of it. and fact is there’s one in every school you’ll always have a professor that is a bit laid back and one that is really anal. In conclusion I hoped my input was helpful for anyone considering U of P and I’d like to add I plan on continuing my MBA with U of P as well.
I am thinking about doing an MBA at either UOP or UMUC.
I am currently a fulltime mom (I took a long break from career for domestic reasons), and want to get back to being a career woman. I already have a Masters in Computer Application. But, with bad economy and bad job market , I want to start MBA and seach for job simultaneously. Any suggestions? Do you think it’ll help me with a fresh start?
Hi all,
I have just completed my MBA from U of P and I am totally and completely satisfied. For my under graduate program I attended one of the top ten brick and mortar schools in the States. After graduation I landed a Job for the Korean Government in one of the largest banks. Since, I was in a foreign country and there are few Korean schools that are recognized in the U.S. I choose the U of P. As I said, the program was amazing. in the past I to had doubts about the legitimacy of the school, but I quickly learn that the U of P is no diploma mill. How do I know? I intentionally did a mediocre job on a 3,000 word research paper and the professor gave me a grade of zero. All I could say when I saw that grade was ” Holly S—”. I spent the remaining 6 weeks busting my a–, and crying to the professor. I tried to get a passing grade, but I still failed the class. I argued my case before the board and they agreed with the professor, so my grade stood. LET ME BE CLEAR! Diploma mills do not give grades of zero, ever.